- This topic has 10 replies, 7 voices, and was last updated 8 years, 4 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
What are the basic rules or aim when creating an environment image? What I’m wanting to achieve is good table contrast, but not that contrasty that the reflections on shiny ramp edges start to look like “jaggies” (image artefacts)
So far I’ve not been able to come up with an image that does just what I want. In the latest Walking Dead for example. It looks fantabulous in the playfield and the ramps are lovely and shiny, but the highlights on the edges of the ramps go that bit to far for my liking and take on that “artefact” look.
I tried one of the other environment images in the table (tute..something?) and it reduced the contrast too far, but the ramps and metal surfaces were gorgeous in terms of the lack of those jaggies.
How do I get to that 1/2 way point in between? What should the environment image contain? How does the detail/pattern effect the result? How contrasty does it need to be? etc etc
If I can get an idea what it is I’m aiming for, perhaps then I’ll have some luck creating my own image.
Cheers, Rusty
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
Hey Rusty… I recently went down this path and downloaded a bunch of .hdr files from various sources to find one I really liked. I can’t help with the technical aspect, but I can say that if you look at the picture that is associated with the .hdr, you can usually get a general idea of how it is going to make your tables look… for instance, if the .hdr has one super glaring white spot, but the rest of the picture is mostly all dark, what you will get on your tables is a dark table with little detail, but the very bright spots will be very white and glaring.
As for the jaggies… I don’t think the .hdr is causing that, but maybe just highlighting those details more with the lighting. I think you may want AA if you are using an environment that shows a lot of detail.
After trying a bunch that I found, this is my current favorite, and I use it on most tables. It shows a good bit of detail and is bright so you don’t want to set the environment over “1” in VPX in most cases. You can further adjust the lighting with the slider, or the environment light numbers, although I don’t stray from the default much in those settings.
I think the preference for an environment is something that is going to vary wildly, so good luck on your hunt.
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
mmmh, i already thought about to do a video which explains the environment feature in vp… Anyone else who is interested?
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
Absolutely, Knorr… go for it.
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
I went through this myself. I have one in my x-files table that I thought was a happy medium. It was pretty basic and high contrast to keep the metal things looking shiny. The ‘overhead’ one that alot of people used seemed to generate strange reflections on prims even when it was set to not have reflections at all.
-Mike
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
Oh I spent days on this. It is very hard to make this work, I made the environment map for TWD in photoshop. There is always the tradeoff between bright reflections and the effect that has on other objects or artefacts. One trick is to blur the environment file, this reduces artefacts but also the dramatic effect of the environment file. I once asked the dev’s for being able to use a different environment file for a primitive, instead of just one for everything. The only true workaround I have is create a texture with highlights in Blender and put the primitive with the texture on “disable lighting”, but that disables the nice lighting effects in VPX.
For my Diner WIP I will once again try again to get the following:
- nice highlights for wireramps and transparent ramps
- good contrast on the rest without artefacts
- no artefacts on the wireramps and the transparent ramps
- no reflections on other objects which look out of place (like the apron)
The general guidelines could be these:
- use a good free HDR from the internet as a base (like “overheadvpx”)
- The upper 20% of the image should be (almost) black usually, otherwise you will have to much shine on ramps and objects
- the lowest 25-50% can be dark/black since they show only on the bottom side of objects, except when you want this (see Knorr’s latest demolition man env. map if I recall)
- highlights for (wire/transparent) ramps usually are placed in the upper 25% area, I copy hightlights from other HDR files and paste them on top of the general HDR map)
And even with this: try to make one, run VPX, see if you like it, adapt/tweak and repeat ad infinitum. And don’t be surprised if it totally fails you when you made a nice one for FS and try it in DT, angle is different.
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
Wow guys, thanks for the responses.
Seems like it’s a tough gig and a lot to ask of a single file. It would be cool if there were separate controls for brightness/contrast and the environment map more controlled just the reflections. Get the reflections right and then just use a brightness/contrast sliders to reach the look required.
Knorr, I too would love to see that video. :)
It’s good to know that greater VP minds than mine are already actively working on this.
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
hdr maps actually contain lighting information, they are panoramic photographs taken at multiple exposures, game engines and 3D software use this information to light a scene as well as give objects something to reflect.
I went through this myself. I have one in my x-files table that I thought was a happy medium. It was pretty basic and high contrast to keep the metal things looking shiny. The ‘overhead’ one that alot of people used seemed to generate strange reflections on prims even when it was set to not have reflections at all. -Mike
The overhead vpx map has a lot of details which look great when reflected in ramps and such but VP’s rendering of reflections and highlights on mesh’s isn’t totally accurate and it picks up those details and does strange things with it. I had that same problem when trying to tune the look of the ramps on Funhouse without making Rudy look like ass, the solution I found was just simply to apply a slight blur to the overheadvpx hdr image.
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
You can actually get a sense of what the ‘environment image’ is doing when it’s actually displayed live as the environment in something like sketchfab, pan the camera around and you’ll see the image dictates how the scene is lit. I used a warm beach hdr map that sketchfab supplies because I thought it suited the model well.
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
1 user thanked author for this post.
The overhead vpx map has a lot of details which look great when reflected in ramps and such but VP’s rendering of reflections and highlights on mesh’s isn’t totally accurate and it picks up those details and does strange things with it. I had that same problem when trying to tune the look of the ramps on Funhouse without making Rudy look like ass, the solution I found was just simply to apply a slight blur to the overheadvpx hdr image.
+1 . I had the same issue, but then I used the environment I found in BK2K and that solved the issue :)
It’s the overehad vpx hdr but in grayscale and blurred , great work flupper
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
Thanks Ninuzzu, shinyenvironment3blur4.hdr is very good indeed. In TDW LE it softens the really hard highlights on the plastics and even gives them a bit of a glow in places.
A reduction in emission to 5 and slight upping of the day/night slider was needed, but the result was that the table maintains pretty good contrast overall.
Of course the original ball had to be changed also, as under the new environment image it went quite D&B (dull & boring)
I need to to play with settings a little more, but it looks like this image will do nicely. :)
Big thanks to flipper also of course
You need to login in order to like this post: click here
Forums are currently locked.
