Advice on DOF devices, enhancing my cabinet

[Gwen]

I am looking at how to proceed with improvements to my Tesla cabinet and could use some advice from those with more experience with DOF devices.

I would like to start by adding proper feedback for the flippers, kickers, and slingshots, etc – so either solenoids or contactors.  Can someone tell me the pros/cons of one vs the other?

I would also like to add a knocker and a shaker motor to my setup.

Essentially I am trying to determine exactly what components I will need to add this stuff to get more proper force feedback from the cabinet and at the same time not spend a pile of money doing it. So I would appreciate suggestions on how to best accomplish that.

Currently I have a PacLed64 driving the led system, and that’s the only real output device I am using other than two audio systems driving the backglass speakers, subwoofer,  and two exciters mounted on the inside walls of the cabinet.  All my devices (except the pin2dmd) are powered by a 12V power supply in the cabinet.

Obviously I’m going to need a controller board, solenoids or contactors, a shaker motor, and a knocker, but I would like to hear from those who have done all this stuff as to how you recommend doing it.  I am particularly interested in what specific controller boards and other devices you prefer and why.  I know there are a number of options but I would really rather not have to waste a bunch of time and money trying them until I find what works well.

Thanks guys! 

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

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[flstclasic]

I use Zebs EZ install kit. Maybe more than you want to spend? Screw it into cabinet, plug a few things in, and ready to go.

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[Gwen]

Yes, definitely more than I can afford to spend.  I have a Zebs plunger V3, which is great.  But I can’t justify spending as much as it would cost to do one of those kits.

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

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[flstclasic]

http://mjrnet.org/pinscape/BuildGuideV2/BuildGuide.php?sid=toc

Have you seen this? Lot of good information.

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Gwen

[newtopinball78]

I was just getting into addressable led and matrix….with octo2811 and teensy 3.2….once you have setup dofconfig tool online and setup cabinet.xml global config and enabled in global settings in popper should it just work or is there something else you need to do??

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[outhere]

Does it work when you run a game from the VP editor

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[newtopinball78]

I tried playing in vpx directly and so far nothing is happening….is there a way to test to see if everything is setup correctly?? I followed tutorial and was able to run test in arduino and matrix lit up…then setup as above…made sure nothing is blocked I was just testing my matrix for now as waiting for my strips

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[outhere]

Post your GlobalConfig_B2SServer.xml and cabinet.xml file

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[outhere]

Make sure this file is named like this —>  GlobalConfig_B2SServer.xml

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newtopinball78

[newtopinball78]

Hey Outhere…..my global config and globalconfig_b2s.server look the same.

 

<?xml version=”1.0″ encoding=”utf-8″?>
<!–Global configuration for the DirectOutput framework.–>
<!–Saved by DirectOutput Version 3.1.7011.27968: 2019-08-03 20-18-36–>
<GlobalConfig>
<LedWizDefaultMinCommandIntervalMs>10</LedWizDefaultMinCommandIntervalMs>
<LedControlMinimumEffectDurationMs>60</LedControlMinimumEffectDurationMs>
<LedControlMinimumRGBEffectDurationMs>120</LedControlMinimumRGBEffectDurationMs>
<PacLedDefaultMinCommandIntervalMs>10</PacLedDefaultMinCommandIntervalMs>
<IniFilesPath />
<CabinetConfigFilePattern>C:\DirectOutput\Config\Cabinet.xml</CabinetConfigFilePattern>
<TableConfigFilePatterns />
<EnableLogging>true</EnableLogging>
<ClearLogOnSessionStart>true</ClearLogOnSessionStart>
<LogFilePattern>.\DirectOutput.log</LogFilePattern>
</GlobalConfig>

 

 

<?xml version=”1.0″?>
<Cabinet xmlns:xsi=”http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance&#8221; xmlns:xsd=”http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema”&gt;
<Name>TimoPin</Name>
<OutputControllers>

<TeensyStripController>
<Name>LEDStripController</Name>
<NumberOfLedsStrip1>256</NumberOfLedsStrip1>
<NumberOfLedsStrip2>0</NumberOfLedsStrip2>
<NumberOfLedsStrip3>0</NumberOfLedsStrip3>
<NumberOfLedsStrip4>0</NumberOfLedsStrip4>
<NumberOfLedsStrip5>0</NumberOfLedsStrip5>
<NumberOfLedsStrip6>0</NumberOfLedsStrip6>
<NumberOfLedsStrip7>0</NumberOfLedsStrip7>
<NumberOfLedsStrip8>0</NumberOfLedsStrip8>
<ComPortName>COM4</ComPortName>
</TeensyStripController>

</OutputControllers>

<Toys>

<LedStrip>
<Name>Backboard</Name>
<Width>32</Width>
<Height>8</Height>
<LedStripArrangement>RightLeftAlternateBottomUp</LedStripArrangement>
<ColorOrder>GRB</ColorOrder>
<FirstLedNumber>1</FirstLedNumber>
<FadingCurveName>SwissLizardsLedCurve</FadingCurveName>
<OutputControllerName>LEDStripController</OutputControllerName>
</LedStrip>

<LedWizEquivalent>
<Name>LedWizEquivalent 30</Name>
<Outputs>

<LedWizEquivalentOutput>
<OutputName>Backboard</OutputName>
<LedWizEquivalentOutputNumber>1</LedWizEquivalentOutputNumber>
</LedWizEquivalentOutput>

</Outputs>
<LedWizNumber>30</LedWizNumber>
</LedWizEquivalent>
</Toys>
<AutoConfigEnabled>true</AutoConfigEnabled>
</Cabinet>

 

 

 

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[Gwen]

Hey guys, I appreciate that you are trying to solve a problem but would you mind doing it in your own thread please?  I’m trying to get some input from people for my setup in this thread.

Thanks 

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

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[Gwen]

So Terry… any thoughts on my questions?

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

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[Zeb]

Hi Gwen,

Contactors have a ‘drier’ sound to them, more of a click than clunk if that makes any sense.  Solenoids have a more ‘wet’ or ‘rattley’ sound to them.  The advantage to contactors is that they can be held on forever due to the low draw nature of their coils while solenoids will heat quickly and burn out their coil in the process, usually taking the controller output driver with them.  A nice compromise is to use solenoids for bumpers and slings and contactors for flippers.

Shaker effects are pretty well integrated into every table and can add to the experience and a replay knocker is what it is, I can take them or leave them myself.

12v contactors are stupidly expensive, if you decide to go with them look at 24v ones and get the heaviest load rated ones you can find (600v 12A for example) to ensure that they close with a satisfying thunk.

Your replay knocker will run fine at 24v but make sure the coil is a 23-800 for that voltage.

I sell plug and play shakers but really, with your talents I would recommend just going with a driver board and controller (I also sell a 24 port controller/driver board hybrid if interested) and run it all from that.  Shaker intensity is controlled through pwm signals from DOF using the Shaker min and Shaker Max settings and the rest is simple ON/OFF control signals (avoid using pwm signals with contactors and solenoids as they don’t respond well to rapid on/off voltage control and generate way too much flyback for most general purpose diodes to suppress effectively.)

Good luck with it!

I know so little about everything that I could tell you all there is to know about nothing

I know so little about everything that I could tell you all there is to know about nothing

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[rgarriott]

I started out with the ford 12v solenoids on my cab. I soon realized that i needed to move on to the 24v siemans contactors. The 12v solenoids although sound very good with a nice deep thud they dont last long. I think i lost 2 of them within 2 months of the cab being finished. They run about $8 new.

The 24v contactor are much more reliable but dont have quite the hard thud as the solenoids, but they do the job well. They are alittle more expensive but I think are worth it.  I bought mine off ebay used for $10 each. So not to much more.

 

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[themotherbrain]

I just want to add to zebs post that I have one of his new revamped shaker motors and it is awesome! You can run other stuff off of the board as well. Worth every penny. I love how it hits when I damage the spaceship in attack from mars.

I’m going full tilt with my cab and have tons of parts stocked up for a rainy day, but if I had to be reasonable I would say get a light bar going behind the playfield. It’s probably the most drastic improvement to the cab. I have 5 domes and 2 strobes and it literally makes every table better visually. I personally like the domes in that spot for the more nostalgic look. If you don’t do anything else do this and I assure you that you won’t regret it.

Surround sound feedback is the first and foremost in my opinion as it is so versatile, but I have 12v solenoids and 24v contactors to install and will run both. Zeb has a solenoid watchdog board to complement his 24 input driver board that is meant to help safeguard against a solenoid or the knocker burning up if you go that route. If you are looking for simple go with his stuff. The parts are super easy to install and his support is excellent as well.

Just my .02

 

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[outhere]

I run Surround sound and solenoids and it’s great

 

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[RustyCardores]

If trying to keep the cost down as you say, then I would first start with SSF (Surround Sound Feedback) and then add the DOF devices that you think you need.

My cab is SSF plus SSFImpactor (which is DOF driven sub-audible bass vibes to a bass shaker to compliment the regular audible sound events) and I want for nothing extra.  I’m even happy with the knocker and shaker with this system, but if I were to add any real mechanicals then I guess these would be the two that I would add.

SSF and DOF happily live together and you can blend as much or as little as you like, it’s all down to personal taste.

 

 

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[Gwen]

Zeb wrote:

Hi Gwen,

Contactors have a ‘drier’ sound to them, more of a click than clunk if that makes any sense.  Solenoids have a more ‘wet’ or ‘rattley’ sound to them.  The advantage to contactors is that they can be held on forever due to the low draw nature of their coils while solenoids will heat quickly and burn out their coil in the process, usually taking the controller output driver with them.  A nice compromise is to use solenoids for bumpers and slings and contactors for flippers.

Shaker effects are pretty well integrated into every table and can add to the experience and a replay knocker is what it is, I can take them or leave them myself.

12v contactors are stupidly expensive, if you decide to go with them look at 24v ones and get the heaviest load rated ones you can find (600v 12A for example) to ensure that they close with a satisfying thunk.

Your replay knocker will run fine at 24v but make sure the coil is a 23-800 for that voltage.

I sell plug and play shakers but really, with your talents I would recommend just going with a driver board and controller (I also sell a 24 port controller/driver board hybrid if interested) and run it all from that.  Shaker intensity is controlled through pwm signals from DOF using the Shaker min and Shaker Max settings and the rest is simple ON/OFF control signals (avoid using pwm signals with contactors and solenoids as they don’t respond well to rapid on/off voltage control and generate way too much flyback for most general purpose diodes to suppress effectively.)

Good luck with it!

I know so little about everything that I could tell you all there is to know about nothing

Thanks Steve, I appreciate the input!  Based on what you tell me I tend to agree that going with solenoids for bumpers and slingshots and contactors for flippers makes the most sense.  Your kits do look great, I just don’t have the money now.   If I can get an income coming in again I will definitely be interested in one of your 24 port controller boards.

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

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[BorgDog]

RustyCardores wrote:

If trying to keep the cost down as you say, then I would first start with SSF (Surround Sound Feedback) and then add the DOF devices that you think you need.

My cab is SSF plus SSFImpactor (which is DOF driven sub-audible bass vibes to a bass shaker to compliment the regular audible sound events) and I want for nothing extra.  I’m even happy with the knocker and shaker with this system, but if I were to add any real mechanicals then I guess these would be the two that I would add.

SSF and DOF happily live together and you can blend as much or as little as you like, it’s all down to personal taste.

 

 

chimes rusty, chimes. you can thank me later.

- Star Wars Wedgehead cab build

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- Star Wars Wedgehead cab build

- Alien Star Resurrection!

 

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[Gwen]

@BorgDog -Thanks , I’m currently using two sound systems – one for the backglass and one for the table sounds.  I have two speakers and two exciters inside the cab for the table sounds and they work pretty well together for now.  I do actually get pretty decent force feedback through the cab walls with the exciters.  When I can afford to I do want to go with solenoids and contactors for more realism.  Any suggestions on where to find chimes at a reasonable price?

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

Gwen
- Wonky builder of the steampunk Nikola Tesla cabinet & Starfighter Cabinet

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