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  • #82419
    Watacaractr
    Participant
    @watacaractr

    Hello all, again. Thank you HauntFreaks for the input on my previous question. I have another ROM question. Does anyone know how to extract sound (.snd, etc.) files from a ROM or if it can be done at all? And not only extract the originals, but replace with your own sounds and/or music? Example: could you replace the ambiance background music in “Elvira and the Party Monsters” with your own music and Elvira’s voice with something else? Obviously you can change the physical table sounds within the editor, but what about the music, voices and effects? Any input would be awesome. Thank you in advance. :-)

    #82420
    Thalamus
    Moderator
    @thalamus
    ContributorMemberModerator

    Open a rom. Look at its size. Then you realize that the sound doesn’t use normal sound formats – *.wav, *.mp3 or whatever. Pins has their own sound chips and you kind of need to revert the process going from something you can play on your PC to the format that toxie and other smart vpinmame devs create emulator routines for. In short – not a small feat. You’re not the first to ask these questions and probably not the last.

    Changing a few bytes that ref to some ascii letters is much easier – and that is what is done with the bubba mod.

    #82452
    Watacaractr
    Participant
    @watacaractr

    Hey thanks Thalamus for the input. The Bubba Rom seems to still have certain music and sounds from Hollywood Heat. I’m just asking if those particular things can be replaced. :)

    #82485
    Thalamus
    Moderator
    @thalamus
    ContributorMemberModerator

    Of course it can be done – but, that’s what I’m getting at. It is not a small feat. So, no one is going to do it. Instead you can do stuff like Xenonph have done, make sound mod of a table. Or, make a p-roc mod (much work, but then again you can change game rules too )  or maybe the easiest way around it. Pinsound. You have pinball browser that can do what your are asking for. But I believe it is only for stern roms.

    #82531
    Watacaractr
    Participant
    @watacaractr

    Thanks Thalamus, I appreciate your info. One question though.. Why is it so easy to change sound and music files in Future Pinball? I can literally change anything in FP. I get that FP is romless but would VPX ever do this? :scratch:

    #82534
    Thalamus
    Moderator
    @thalamus
    ContributorMemberModerator

    Exactly. You can change any VP original table since the sound isn’t embedded in rom. And, don’t talk to me about FP … I bite ! :)

    1 user thanked author for this post.
    Rat
    #82535
    Watacaractr
    Participant
    @watacaractr

    lol, ok no FP then.. although.. I wish someone could take it over and at least make an effort to update it to at least VPX standards. Don’t get me wrong, I love VPX and always will, but it would be cool to have 2 really cool programs out there.  :-)

    #82616
    HauntFreaks
    Moderator
    @hauntfreaks
    vipContributorMember

    building an original in VP is no different then building any FP its all the same crap… just tell it to play the sounds and voila it plays it…
    its only when using a ROM based game this can be an issue… easiest machines to use as an original are the early SS machines (no dmd , no alphanumeric)
    so again there is no difference at all between FP and VP when it comes to originals…. just the the end product will be 1000 times better in VPX
    FP is dead, chris killed it like 10yrs ago… it will never get better when it comes to the editor itself, it will never be updated, beyond bam nothing more will ever move forward…. its like trying to run a windows 3.1 machine and wasting time trying to get it to work in the modern day…. those talented dudes from FP just need to fuckin wake up and move the fuck on… its not a he said she said thing any more… the bitch has died… move on, learn something new…. and we all can benefit

    #82636
    Watacaractr
    Participant
    @watacaractr

    @hauntfreaks… I couldn’t agree more.. Now.  :good:

    #211883
    mrjcrane
    Participant
    @mrjcrane

    So I am a nobody with no current skills in comparison to all the awesome VPX developers, and I am super late to the party but trying to find a way to superimpose a audio track in place of what may have existed on an original dedicated rom chip is something I still try to think my way out of.  Example Star Trek (Bally 1979),  Game start audio track is “Oh give me a home where the buffalo roam”, a synthesized track; was some of the best audio technology could offer in 1979 and I appreciate all the game developers efforts. But buffalo don’t have a lot to do with deep space exploration and alien beings. And what if Captain Kirk could do the intro track to that game??

    Back in the day when all we had was 8-bits to contend with, we would use Hex Editors and other tools to find where stuff was in compiled programs (to find Start points and Stop points) then even make changes.  If the custom sound rom chip concept could be “emulated” in VPX, the stored audio samples could be indexed and/or muted, then it may be possible to substitute in a re-pointed index to a more modern sound sample.  Come to think about this, is this not what is happening with Simpsons Treehouse of Horror, in that a lot of the original samples are muted or at least some samples are muted?

    I’m probably way off on this but it would really nice to give a lot of games an audio face-lift; in a similar manner that PUP has done in enhancing the entire backglass experience.  Just food for thought.

    #211895
    Thalamus
    Moderator
    @thalamus
    ContributorMemberModerator

    Sure. Make or take the c-code from pinmame – extract the samples, change the music, revert the process – done. Easy and good luck. I expect it it is much easier to make timers that turn off the pinmame sound at start, replace it with a provided sample, then after that is played, enable pinmame sound again. You are talking about the start of the game – right ?

    #211917
    Tom
    Participant
    @armyaviation
    MemberContributor

    How do they make the muted sounds roms for these pup pack tables

    #211926
    Thalamus
    Moderator
    @thalamus
    ContributorMemberModerator

    Depends. Some roms have separate *.snd files – not very hard to write zero’s to it. If you figure location, zero’s will do the trick. If it is Stern, well, then you have tools like pinball browser (does what I’m talking about, and more) that know where the sound start/end, and if payed version, should be able to write back chunks of 0. The eay one is of course to turn of the rom sound via the table script. Pup can easily play its own sounds.

    1 user thanked author for this post.
    Tom
    #211931
    CarnyPriest
    Participant
    @carnypriest
    Member

    Should replace home on the range with row, row, row your boat

    #211934
    mrjcrane
    Participant
    @mrjcrane

    Thalamus, big help on shedding light on forcing zeros to mute sounds. Thanks !!! I’m going to experiment with that a bit.  I’m guessing in 1979 they would burn the sounds or samples to a dedicated EPROM and or use some kind of synthesis chip for music (for non-sampled audio). So the beeps, boops, boinks and bings may not be too bad to deal with if an EPROM could be emulated some how.

    #211937
    mrjcrane
    Participant
    @mrjcrane

    Thalamus, so just one followup. If I turn off the “global rom sound” inside the table script then I build my own sound library, then play the individual sounds at the right time and right place in the table script, I kind of get a similar result?? Comparing it to a custom non-rom game like Minions, Minions just has to make the right sound call at the right time, correct?

    #211964
    Thalamus
    Moderator
    @thalamus
    ContributorMemberModerator

    That’s correct. There are several music tables being uploaded that you can learn from. Take mousing around for example. There is a Iron Maiden mod for that rom and the way that they did it is of high quality. Also the Led Zeppelin is very well done. And, there is nothing really holding you back from putting pup on top of that. Personally, I’m not a great fan of non-authentic stuff, but, both those mentioned are so well done that I can only describe them as well worth downloading, even for me.

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