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I have no issues with the backglass speakers, they sound great, the playfield speakers are 4 exciters and 2 lepy 2.1 amps.  There is almost no feedback and no bass coming out of the exciters.  I have a 3/4 inch thick plywood cab and the front 2 are pretty close to the flippers and the back 2 are below the back of the tv.  I did have a 6 inch sub on the front amp and sound wasn’t bad but I can’t feel shit for tactile feedback?  Any thoughts
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Are you using pinvol? The latest release supports ssf. You can up the gain on the front and rear exciters. That’s what I’m currently doing. Going through tables and adjusting the gain to my liking.
I also reccomend updating vpx to 10.6.2 that was just released as it has improved ssf.
On a side note thanks for all the tables you have shared with the community.
Hi my name is Barry and I'm a virtual pinball addict.
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Appreciate it!
as for pinvol, I do not use it.  I already thought it was just to equalize the different sounds on each table and I never had that much of an issue.  If it adds bass to the exciters I will definitely try it.  I did install thump and i didn’t like the way it made it sound.
I will check out the new 10.6You need to login in order to like this post: click here
Doesn’t sound right to me that you don’t feel the exciters. I recommend that you disable all sound devices that you don’t use. EQapo is just a good sent program, and it seems that the newest PinVol relies on it too. But, I have for a long time been able to hear and feel the exciters. That is also something you should be able to. If you just add amplification to your setup, instead of figuring out what the problem is, then, all of a sudden, one day the cab might sound very different :)
In the 10.7beta thread you can see me several times mentioning the backglass being played very low. Only by switching in between the actual sound device and default, did that change things around for me. There must be a bug somewhere, because only yesterday, this happened again. What I had to do to solve it was to put the mode to 2-channel, then exit, Start again, put back the new 7.1 and change the output devices again. This time, for the very odd reason, backglass back to default and the other to the real-tek. This was exactly the same setting I have had for a long time, but, started to act up. This is also why I say, that there must be a bug lurking around in there. Maybe you are getting the complete opposite result where your exciters are getting muffled instead of the backglass ?
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I am not totally following what you are saying @thalamus but I am not lost either. Â I will take another look at my setup and maybe post pics. Â I did notice the other day ver faint flippers on my backglass channels when I was testing but I have never installed 10.7
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Well, for 10.7beta – be aware, it has weirdness going on for the backglass. Mentioned in the beta thread. Stick with 10.6.2 for now for the tables that are created for 10.6 and earlier.
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So do you hear anything from your exciters when you go into your sound driver setup? Â Realtek I assume.
if you get back glass sounds, plug you back glass line out into one of your exciter amps.  Do the exciters work then?  If so, check the line out assignments in your audio settings  Ensure that you have the back panel ports assigned to the correct speaker sets  With Realtek, unplugging and replugging will prompt you for what you just plugged in  Failing that, right click on the image of the port itself and change the configuration   With 7.1 selected and playing the test sounds it should cycle through all sets of speakers If you don’t hear anything from an output it’s likely that it’s assigned incorrectly  Windows 10 upgrade just blew away my line out assignments and I had to set them up again
In my experience the amp volume for exciters needs to be a lot higher than the amp for regular speakers to get comparable sound levels. Â Check that.
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I don’t have 10.7 and all speakers are putting out the correct sounds.  It was only a couple tables that I noticed with the pf amps turned off I could hear a faint sound of the flippers.  Whit amps on I can hear all sounds including ball on the correct side of the table .
where is 10.6.2. In the 10.6 standalone?
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Found it
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The only thing I haven’t tried was suggested by @mlager8 I am using the red/white composite to a headphone jack cable for the audio to amp from computer.  Would it matter using a 3.5 mm on both ends and plugging into the headphone jack/mp3 on the amp
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So… 10.6 has a known issue with the surround implementation where pf sounds are sometimes faintly played through the backglass speakers.
Running 10.7 and selecting 7.1 enhanced in VPX audio settings should resolve this.
Your original post referenced no sound from SSF amps.
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Maybe there is confusion, the pf exciter sounds are fine. Â The have the correct sounds coming out of each exciter. Â They sound like a great stereo system with absolutely NO bass at all. No bass means no tactile feedback
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In windows sound, do you have full range speakers checked or unchecked. Â Mine was checked
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When I doubted mine I rewired the exciters + bass shaker I was testing (actually I used equalizer apo to redirect the channels) to my main (front) stereo output and played some bass heavy music videos on youtube (did a search for bass shaker test music videos or something). Start with volume low. When they hit the bass segments my neighbors had no doubt my bass shaker was active. I didn’t try with just the exciters but I imagine it would give you a good idea what you can expect from them.
But it does depend on how well the table implements the SSF features, how good their sound samples were, and how loud the pf sounds are being played. The exciters need a combination of bass and loudness in order to get a good feeling of tactile feedback.
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That’s a good idea.  What about polarity of the exciters, would reversing the + and – have any effect or is it irrelevant
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Yes I believe that could be exactly it actually. My understanding is limited about the subject but it effects phase and can effect bass in particular, it’s definitely worth a look.
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You don’t mention if you have a bass shaker.
You’re not gonna get much tactile out of the small guys. Location of the exciters on the surface can greatly impact their effectiveness…
Ideally you position them close to 3/5, 2/5 rule. See here… https://www.daytonaudio.com/topic/excitersbuyerguide
How the exciters are mounted can also impact their effectiveness… The ‘speaker’ part should be taped or glued to the cabinet. If you have the kind with screw holes, those are for mounting the exciters to a fixture like wall or a post. The exciter should not be screwed down onto the resonating surface. That will limit transference of the vibration to the cabinet. It’ll still work, of course, just not as well.
You describe that you have 4 exciters and 2 2.1 amps. The bass channel on those amps is connected to what?
If you want to feel anything there should be one of these on each amp. You can get away with the smaller shaker they sell on the rear channel. That’s what I have and it’s fine.
But you need the big boy on the side channel for pop bumpers.
https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton-Audio-BST-1-High-Power-Pro-Tactile-Bass-Shaker-50-Watts-295-244
Bass shakers plus SSFThump will do the trick.
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That was my question, I thought exciter put out tactile, not the bass shaker?. Most setups I see don’t say to put a bass shaker on each pf  amps
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It’s a matter of degree. When I disconnect my shakers, there isn’t much there… Gotta have them if you have a full-sized cab with 3/4 ply.
Some people use a hybrid setup where they use a subwoofer instead, even sharing the sub between the backbox and exciters… It’s called the Rob Method I think.
Still doesn’t compare using the BST-1s.
It’s interesting that shakers don’t appear in many example setups. Not sure why that is. They’re essential.
Of course, the bass shaker creates a new problem if you have analog nudge…Â You either need to turn the nudge deadzone way up or you need to isolate your KLZ from the vibration somehow.
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I agree. If you really want to feel it, you need the bass shakers. With just exciters you need them as close to where your hands are as you can (normally one set is pretty close to your flipper buttons). The exciters will give you a higher frequency buzz feeling, the bass shaker gives a thump. But make sure you have the polarity right and play some youtube tests through them and you’ll get an idea of what to expect. If you mount the exciters with just screws you will probably get a buzz/rattle at some frequencies/loudness depending on how tight the screws are and the cabinet material. Two of mine are fine with just screws, two of them rattle under some circumstances… I need to remount them.
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